Paid trainers

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NotPWizard
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Re: Paid trainers

Post by NotPWizard » Sun May 21, 2017 12:28 pm

Yes, I am so stealthy. Someone in your community asked for a 64-bit version of cheats for 1.03 of the game in which this site has neither. I mentioned that there is an alternative available. I didn't link a site, mention a source or anything that would break the rules that seem to be pick and choose depending on the user.

hedop
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Re: Paid trainers

Post by hedop » Sun May 21, 2017 12:56 pm

NotPWizard wrote:
Sun May 21, 2017 12:28 pm
Yes, I am so stealthy. Someone in your community asked for a 64-bit version of cheats for 1.03 of the game in which this site has neither. I mentioned that there is an alternative available. I didn't link a site, mention a source or anything that would break the rules that seem to be pick and choose depending on the user.
Dude just please go away. That guy asked for an update on a table that was basically just posted with the patch being out for less than a couple of hours. I told you yesterday. It's a table thread. Not a trainer thread. For all I care post that stuff in the trainer section, see how the trainer makers treat you. It's just shitty behviour. You told STN yesterday you could wait for a decision and you told me yesterday in the other thread that you will leave the community, yet here you are again promoting and justifying your shitty behaviour. Just go away already.

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Re: Paid trainers

Post by NotPWizard » Sun May 21, 2017 1:07 pm

NP. When your site folds because STN is left holding the bill and putting time, money and resources into a project that people like yourself don't financially support and all of your users end up at CH anyway, you can look back at when I offered to help but was told to piss off.

STN and RaDeX know how to reach me should they wish to speak for themselves instead of allowing people like yourself and SunBeam represent the entire community (which, PS, many are already premium subscribers at our site - feel free to check the memberlist). They both know that I never said anything derogatory about the people making cheats, providing tables or trainers here.

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Re: Paid trainers

Post by hedop » Sun May 21, 2017 1:29 pm

NotPWizard wrote:
Sun May 21, 2017 1:07 pm
NP. When your site folds because STN is left holding the bill and putting time, money and resources into a project that people like yourself don't financially support and all of your users end up at CH anyway, you can look back at when I offered to help but was told to piss off.

STN and RaDeX know how to reach me should they wish to speak for themselves instead of allowing people like yourself and SunBeam represent the entire community (which, PS, many are already premium subscribers at our site - feel free to check the memberlist). They both know that I never said anything derogatory about the people making cheats, providing tables or trainers here.
That is their decision. No one ever said people who are members here couldn't be members on CH or wherever really. Why the hell are you even trying something like that man? It's not a war. Nobody here is working towards blasting CH out of existence or whatever. Do your thing. But don't do it here without the big wigs having decided whether you can or you can not and what rules apply for you and yours. You didn't. You told STN:

"I have all the patience in the world. If the users here don't want me around, I'll be happy to leave." Yet you didn't wait for a decision did you? Just went ahead and stealth advertised your trainers anyway instead of waiting it out.

You also said to me:

"I'll go now. You guys enjoy spinning your wheels."

Yet here you are, debating the merits of your conduct, still stealth advertising. That is the third time now that you said you will go and leave us poor people to suffer and the site crash because only through your help can this site exist in the future.

You know what I think? I think the whole Ddos Attack on CE was your guys doing. I think you Ddosed the site half to death, I think you put the feds on CE and I think you guys are behind Ddosing this site. All that shit seems mighty shady to me. Why even bother supporting this shitty little shack of a site that makes no money, offers stuff for free that you guys monetize, isn't even among the first google search results, is ad free, has no other income. What's the play here? Underestimated the resilience and that people would reform the site and keep going after your brought DB to his knees? Now you tried it here but since the site is better protected you can't and now you try to undermine it from within by spamming around or trying to force your way in via money?

That's a fucking powerplay if ever I saw one. If STN would agree to a business deal with you, all the site data would be open to you guys. Everything, because there would need to be a formal contract. Meaning you guys get everything on this site, on the admins, on the site owner, meaning you are again in a position to call in the feds to take action against the site and Ddos the shit out of it.

Well played. Now go back to where you came from.

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Re: Paid trainers

Post by STN » Sun May 21, 2017 1:53 pm

Okay here we go. First off
Klempnermeister wrote:
Sat May 20, 2017 5:37 pm
Its not better if you start bitching at hijm @hedop. If he isn't violating a rule just ignore him. God.. I'm missing CE forum and Dark Byte's moderation already...
Something isn't right about you, you don't contribute or give a crap about this place for a month you're registered here, then all of a sudden you're very concerned about the rules of this place and then you don't like how i run things and miss CEF? I don't see you have a profile at CEF either so what do you know how things are there.

But since you like Dark Byte's way of running things, i will give you that treatment :) You would get banned for speaking against staff there, hell you get banned "for fun" by some of the mods there.

Now to the real issue at hand.

@Pwizard: I have discussed this in length with people who matter here and it's very clear to us that the community doesn't want you here. I appreciate your offer, really do and you're right you can offer more than we can get from donations but ultimately, you're here because of the community and i am not going to do something that they don't want because you're not going to be here if they leave, would you?. It is nothing personal, the community doesn't want you...you must have gotten some idea from the posts of people here.

I don't see the place as folding anytime soon, the analytics show half the traffic here is returning visitors. It will fold if someone DDOSes and i don't have the money to pay but twice now, people have helped me upgrade and pay for a better server. It's not 74$ by the way, it's 199$/month and we achieved that goal within hours this month plus change.

Sunbeam and hedop has said what i was going to say next.

BooBoo and other people can post the way they want to and the rules i posted earlier are a guideline and we will decide if someone is abusing them/issue warns/bans accordingly. Dark Byte was lax on his rules too and didn't always enforce it in trainers section for one simple reason, rules are meant to stop people from abusing the place, as long as no one abuses them you can relax. Use your common sense, help the community and you will be fine.

I expect this thread to end now, everyone had their say and made their point and it's been decided how things will be going forward.

Lets all go back to making and using cheats!.

hedop
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Re: Paid trainers

Post by hedop » Sun May 21, 2017 1:57 pm

Yeah let's go cheaters, let's go!

duducasarotto
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Re: Paid trainers

Post by duducasarotto » Wed Apr 10, 2019 2:35 am

So far as I know you only need one acc to download the premium CH trainers so if someone create a premium account he could post the download link for the premium trainers and we could use them for free or we could help this guy pay for the premium account

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Re: Paid trainers

Post by TheyCallMeTim13 » Wed Apr 10, 2019 3:28 am

duducasarotto wrote:
Wed Apr 10, 2019 2:35 am
So far as I know you only need one acc to download the premium CH trainers so if someone create a premium account he could post the download link for the premium trainers and we could use them for free or we could help this guy pay for the premium account
They would be removed, simply because it's the right thing to do. And then who ever posted it would most likely be banned for posting a trainer they don't have permission to post. It would actually violate the forum rules.
CE wiki - Tutorials CE wiki - Auto Assembler Basics - CE wiki - Lua Basics If it's not a Personal Message don't PM me, use the forum. I ignore PMs that should be asked on the forum.

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Re: Paid trainers

Post by Dread_Pony_Roberts » Tue Oct 01, 2019 1:53 am

I suppose an alternative to paid trainers would be cheat commissions, where a customer doesn't pay to download the trainer but instead he pays for you to make the cheat. I say cheats because you could use this method for both trainers and tables, since nobody can steal something that was never created.

This would mean you could only charge for the cheat once, so you would have to offset this by charging more for a commission. I don't know if it could make up for the difference, but it would guarantee that your efforts are only put into cheats which would turn up a profit (that is assuming you don't get swindled, which is its own issue entirely).
How fair is it that you are the only one with a One Hit Kill? What if the AI had just as much power? That would definitely make the gameplay a bit more...EXTREME!

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Re: Paid trainers

Post by SunBeam » Tue Oct 01, 2019 9:39 am

Dread_Pony_Roberts wrote:
Tue Oct 01, 2019 1:53 am
I suppose an alternative to paid trainers would be cheat commissions, where a customer doesn't pay to download the trainer but instead he pays for you to make the cheat. I say cheats because you could use this method for both trainers and tables, since nobody can steal something that was never created.

This would mean you could only charge for the cheat once, so you would have to offset this by charging more for a commission. I don't know if it could make up for the difference, but it would guarantee that your efforts are only put into cheats which would turn up a profit (that is assuming you don't get swindled, which is its own issue entirely).
But you could steal to create. And get paid for another's work :P Never thought of that, did you?..

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Re: Paid trainers

Post by Dread_Pony_Roberts » Wed Oct 02, 2019 3:29 am

SunBeam wrote:
Tue Oct 01, 2019 9:39 am
But you could steal to create. And get paid for another's work :P Never thought of that, did you?..
The same can occur with paid trainers. Someone could easily download a bunch of tables from these forums and turn them into trainers, then all he has to do is start charging for them. The best counter to these methods are to inform others about it, admins and the original owners especially.
I should also have clarified that with this method the cheats would be released to the public as soon as the customer pays for them, mostly as an insurance so that the customer can't release it ahead of you and claim that it's his.

I will be honest, this would be my preferred method for cheat makers getting paid for their efforts. I'd hate to use BooBoo as the only example of this thread, but her trainers are the best example at the moment. Take her Metro Exodus trainer here for example (https://www.ddstrainers.com/metro-exodus-trainer). In this trainer the only cheat available in the demo is the Add Medkits cheat, while locking everything else behind the payment such as Infinite Health, Add Ammo, and No Reload. My main issue with paid cheats is that their limitations feel very arbitrary, even while better FREE cheats exist such as this one (viewtopic.php?t=8764).

This is why I feel that cheat commissions would wind up being better for both the customers and the cheat makers. The customers would appreciate it since even if their game is obscure and boring and they have very specific script requests, a cheat maker would still create a cheat for it as long as the customer had the money. The cheat makers would benefit from it since give him a higher chance of compensation for his work.

There are of course technicalities such as price per a cheat, extra costs for boring games, extra costs for difficult scripts, and cost to update the cheats if the games update. There is even the issue of someone overcharging their cheats or running off with the customer's money. All these technicalities and issues can be solved with a healthy market and a dose of admin moderation.
How fair is it that you are the only one with a One Hit Kill? What if the AI had just as much power? That would definitely make the gameplay a bit more...EXTREME!

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Re: Paid trainers

Post by SunBeam » Wed Oct 02, 2019 9:42 am

Dread_Pony_Roberts wrote:
Wed Oct 02, 2019 3:29 am
SunBeam wrote:
Tue Oct 01, 2019 9:39 am
But you could steal to create. And get paid for another's work :P Never thought of that, did you?..
The same can occur with paid trainers. Someone could easily download a bunch of tables from these forums and turn them into trainers, then all he has to do is start charging for them. The best counter to these methods are to inform others about it, admins and the original owners especially.
I should also have clarified that with this method the cheats would be released to the public as soon as the customer pays for them, mostly as an insurance so that the customer can't release it ahead of you and claim that it's his.
That's pretty much what most of these fights are about: who steals from who and proof :) Welcome to the story :P

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Re: Paid trainers

Post by Dread_Pony_Roberts » Wed Oct 02, 2019 1:01 pm

SunBeam wrote:
Wed Oct 02, 2019 9:42 am
That's pretty much what most of these fights are about: who steals from who and proof :) Welcome to the story :P
Essentially, and that is why I'm throwing my alternative out there, since I feel that it would be a more acceptable form of income.
How fair is it that you are the only one with a One Hit Kill? What if the AI had just as much power? That would definitely make the gameplay a bit more...EXTREME!

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Re: Paid trainers

Post by SunBeam » Wed Oct 02, 2019 2:10 pm

Here's my alternative: viewforum.php?f=2. Label it [PAID REQUEST] and people will become interested.

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Re: Paid trainers

Post by STN » Wed Oct 02, 2019 2:17 pm

I don't understand. Isn't this what's happening with requests?

We have paid requests, the requester if he so wishes can offer incentive to make a table or trainer.

How is this different than the compensation thing you're suggesting?

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